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Butyl in Germany

Posted on Poppers Guide's Forum

Topic created by Hornyrhino
on Wed, 22 Mar 2023 at 05:34

Hornyrhino said on Wed, 22 Mar 2023 at 05:34...

How I can find this in Germany?

Where to find best poppers here?

Popper users in Cologne arent aware of quality differences.

PopperExpert said on Wed, 22 Mar 2023 at 16:38...

Here in the USA, nobody knows where to buy the absolute best, and most consistent poppers either. When I first started poppers in 2007, I NEVER had to ask where to buy good poppers. They were available everywhere and I used them in the sex clubs. They were always fun.

Joseph F. Miller out of Indiana was the primary maker then. He died in 2010 and since then everyone is asking....what you are...where can you get good, reliable poppers.

If anyone knows...please tell us!!!! All I ever see are inconsistent reviews. This bottle from them was OK, that bottle was ineffective crap. This order was OK, that order sucked.

Popperasswipe said on Wed, 22 Mar 2023 at 16:45...

A good popper should always....

STRONGLY relax the ass,

Rarely if ever give noticeable side effects even with frequent use.

Smell good to neutral(nondescript)

Give a temporary surge of sexual interest/energy.

The closest common nitrite that fits that description is n-pentyl nitrite. CAS 463-04-7

BrewMeister... said on Wed, 22 Mar 2023 at 19:15...

I just tried some months old n-pentyl nitrite I had sitting round at room temp. I thought it was bad, but lo and behold, it's good!!!
Odor is slightly "clove oil" like and pleasant. I added more potassium carbonate to it since at first it was causing my nostrils to sting a bit. The Kcarb stopped the "stinging" and it gave a better overall effect, nice ass relax....pleasant, sensual, relaxing, fun sensations.

Nitritespecialist said on Wed, 22 Mar 2023 at 19:18...

It's illegal to sell n-pentyl or isopentyl nitrite in most, if not all Western Countries without a Script from a Doctor.
So...anyone actually making and selling it is taking a HUGE risk. But from my vast experience of making poppers for 12 years, it's proven to be the best hands down.

Nitritespecialist said on Wed, 22 Mar 2023 at 19:23...

You can have fun with the other nitrites, isopropyl, butyl and isobutyl nitrite....BUT they are far more likely to cause noticeable side effects, especially if you take frequent hits straight from a bottle, which is the conventional way. Anemia, blue skin, and low blood pressure are the typical immediate side effects. These don't take days to develop. Often, for me, they occur in less than 30 minutes. All manner of impurities are possible and these impart their own odors/effects, which usually do not make the experience better.

Anonymous said on Wed, 22 Mar 2023 at 19:31...

You might ask yourself why didn't the chemists/druggists use other types of alkyl nitrites for angina medicine back in the 1800s and 1900s. They certainly knew about the other nitrites. They even noted how isobutyl nitrite seemed to be "stronger" than pentyl nitrite. No doubt, it's because as stated from 12 years of making and using the various alkyl nitrites used for poppers, pentyl nitrite is the ONLY one that NEVER made me feel like shit EVEN when clearly the purity was always in question. Even when I bought professionally made alkyl nitrites from leading chemical makers, isopentyl nitrite NEVER caused me to have horrible side effects, BUT butyl and isobutyl nitrite did.

Anonymous said on Wed, 22 Mar 2023 at 19:33...

There are those who claim butyl and isobutyl nitrite are the BEST....but is this because they sell the stuff and this is all that's legal to sell without a script in the USA and many other countries? I don't sell anything...neither methods nor products...so my opinion and information is based exclusively on my authentic personal experience and nothing else.

Billy said on Wed, 22 Mar 2023 at 23:59...

I really donít know what any of those answers have to do with OPís question. Apart perhaps from serving as a cautionary tale in showing the cognitive decline caused by chronic poppers use.

Ethe said on Thu, 23 Mar 2023 at 12:59...

It feels like one guy monologuing with different accounts lol

But yeah butyl isn't legal in Europe, if you want some you need to import it from somewhere where it's legal like USA

They do the same to get some Amyl from Europe

Billy said on Thu, 23 Mar 2023 at 16:03...

It IS one guy monologuing with different accounts!

Anonymous said on Fri, 24 Mar 2023 at 00:00...

The German user stated that people in Cologne(German) don't know the differences between the various poppers.....I informed him and them. I'm not relying upon gray market "labels" that may are not accurately indicate what's in poppers...I either make my own OR I buy professionally made alkyl nitrites, from TCI, Sigma and Alfa. If such information sounds less credible to some...so be it. Trust those who casually buy poppers and have no idea about them.

Anonymous said on Fri, 24 Mar 2023 at 00:01...

I also answered his question.....by implying that if nobody in the USA is selling reliably good poppers...then I doubt it's any different in Europe. Why else would he be asking???

Nitritespecialist said on Fri, 24 Mar 2023 at 00:04...

To those who doubt that amyl nitrite is the "safest" of the common nitrites....look no further than Australia and what they determined there. Part of their consideration to make ONLY amyl nitrite available in drug stores without a script, BUT not the other types, is due to the fact that amyl nitrite is safer...less toxic...than isopropyl, butyl and isobutyl nitrite. Nobody has to tell me this. I KNOW it for a FACT because I have a ton of personal experience.

Nitritespecialist said on Fri, 24 Mar 2023 at 00:08...

Anyone claiming that amyl nitrite is more toxic via sniffing than the other common alkyl nitrites needs to provide evidence and a good explanation why it was long considered safe by the authorities as a medicine and was available OTC from 1960 to 1969, when the only reason it was put back behind the counter, was due to the increase in its recreational use.

Really....Google is a wonderful device...I encourage everyone to use it more and perhaps less of Grindr??

Nitritespecialist said on Fri, 24 Mar 2023 at 00:13...

Good evidence is NOT..." well my OTC bottles stated on the label that it contained isoamyl nitrite"......maybe it did...maybe it didn't. We all should know that the labels(except on professionally made alkyl nitrites) are often wrong or insufficient, never listing impurities, amounts and level of purity of active ingredient.

Kip said on Fri, 24 Mar 2023 at 01:10...

Stfu loser.

Kip said on Fri, 24 Mar 2023 at 03:06...

I just had good amyl and smoked a bowl. I take that back. I am gay and stoopid.

padre said on Fri, 24 Mar 2023 at 19:46...

you got it right mate; this guy's a lunatic

Nitritespecialist said on Fri, 24 Mar 2023 at 00:04...

To those who doubt that amyl nitrite is the "safest" of the common nitrites....look no further than Australia and what they determined there. Part of their consideration to make ONLY amyl nitrite available in drug stores without a script, BUT not the other types, is due to the fact that amyl nitrite is safer...less toxic...than isopropyl, butyl and isobutyl nitrite. Nobody has to tell me this. I KNOW it for a FACT because I have a ton of personal experience.

translation for non-morons
"I don't live in Australia, I'm not familiar with their laws, but I want you to THINK that they only permit amyl because it's safer, so I'll stuff MY personal opinion into THEIR rulings.

People WITH a clue understand that Australia's government moved to prohibit ALL alkyl nitrites, making them a Schedule 9 Prohibited Substance. The LGBTQ+ community fought against this decision on many fronts, and the decision was postponed for a year to gather information about the possibility of homophobic discrimination.

The END result was that NO alkyl nitrites were switched to schedule 9, MOST of the alkyl nitrites remain a legal grey area, IsoPropyl and n-Propyl nitrites are banned due to associated eye problems, and n-Amyl nitrite will be available without prescription.

NONE OF THE DECISONS HAD ANYTHING TO DO WITH A SUPPOSED SUPERIORITY OF AMYL OVER BUTYL; it was a bad law that didn't serve anybody, and could be interpreted as being disc riminatory

Nitritespecialist said on Sat, 25 Mar 2023 at 01:48...

I emailed some of those involved in Australia. And they most certainly were comparing the relative safety of the various nitrites. Only an unthinking person would think otherwise. Why else were they not treated as if they were identical compounds with identical effects???

I never stated that "amyl" was superior to anything. I stated that it was less toxic....meaning it could be sniffed a lot longer without noticeable or horrible side effects. I know it from lots of personal experience and I have read others make a similar claim. Butyl nitrite in particular has made me extremely unwell in just a matter of 5 to 10 minutes. If anyone suggests I'm lying, then there's nothing I will say that they will believe is true, because they've made the decision to ignore all of my personal experience.
In any event, professionally made, fully legit amyl is still not available in Australia. Locker Room Jungle Juice in Canada supposedly makes amyl and that's what I've seen for sale there.

Nitritespecialist said on Sat, 25 Mar 2023 at 01:55...

Padre stated that IPN was banned in Australia because of a serious health concern....it allegedly causes eye problems. Hmmmmmm....sounds like it must be more TOXIC...less safe to inhale than amyl. And the reason it was banned was health/toxicity related. Oh wait....the authorities in Australia never thought it was a good idea to compare the relative toxicities of the various nitrites before they decided to make amyl available in drug stores without a Script. They just went with the conventional idea, long established, that amyl nitrite was safe enough to make available OTC without any script from 1960 to 1969. Please find a similar claim made about butyl/ isobutyl and IPN?

Nitritespecialist said on Sat, 25 Mar 2023 at 01:59...

IPN, butyl and isobutyl nitrite may NEVER make YOU feel very unwell, but they have me.....not once....not twice....but very many times.

Amyl nitrite may make you feel very UNWELL, but it NEVER did for me after hundreds and hundreds of uses. So it's up to the individual user to decide which is the "rule" and which is the "exception". Or which is less toxic and which is more.

Tony said on Sat, 25 Mar 2023 at 05:16...

@Nitritespecialist: To the best of my knowledge, Locker Room Mfg in Canada does not sell a nitrite product / formula that is Amyl Nitrite.

If any participant on this forum can positively confirm that LRM Canada is now selling a nitrite product / formula that is Amyl Nitrite, then that would be very useful information for everyone.

padre said on Sat, 25 Mar 2023 at 18:29...

there's no need to get bitchy with multiple posts containing more and more lies. Simply put, you made a claim and appended it to an actual court case, then somehow encouraged others to GOOGLE IT and see for themselves.

Well, I GOOGLED IT, and the facts of the case don't agree with your ASSumptions.

your major claims if i;m getting this right is that amyl is in your words 'the best and safest' although you do back-pedal and lie to me, saying you didn't just says so, but:

Nitritespecialist said on Wed, 22 Mar 2023 at 19:
n-pentyl or isopentyl nitrite....it's proven to be the best hands down.

Nitritespecialist said on Sat, 25 Mar 2023 at 01:48...
I never stated that "amyl" was superior to anything

While discussing this proposed law (trying to make ALL nitrites illegal) hearings were held to gather public opinion, and health system information was gathered for 12 months. Both public opinion and health care information was considered.

FIRST, the propyls

"Date of effect of the decision: 1 February 2020. Reasons for the final decision (including findings on material questions of fact): I have made the decision to place isopropyl nitrite and N-propyl nitrite in Schedule 10 to make them prohibited substances for the reasons set out below. On my reading of the toxicity data for isopropyl nitrite there is some evidence for serious but rare temporary or permanent retinal maculopathy. It is my understanding that N-propyl nitrite has a high acute toxicity and volatility and based on the limited data, the relative toxicity of the alkyl nitrites, including carcinogenicity, is likely to correlate with increasing volatility, as indicated by their vapour pressure. In making my decision I considered that there was no support for the scheduling of all alkyl nitrites in Schedule 10. "

Australia's dept. of health sees a distinction between Propanol based alkyl nitrites and all the rest. they identify this distinction based on overall volatility of Propanol based poppers being so dramatically higher than the others

luckily, " In making my decision I considered that there was no support for the scheduling of all alkyl nitrites in Schedule 10. " so they decided NOT to ban ALL popper types

SECOND: they then looked at the other nitrites
"I have made a decision to not change the entries in Schedule 4 for isoamyl nitrite, butyl nitrite, isobutyl nitrite and octyl nitrite which currently enable their supply with a prescription. In the following section I will set out the reasons for these decisions. "

the above mentioned nitrite types remain available by prescription only.

THIRD: amyl nitrite will be made available without a prescription.

"I took into account that the documented clinical experience in support of the muscle relaxant effects associated with the alkyl nitrite family of substances are limited to amyl nitrite, which I note was previously used for the treatment of angina. "

In his own words amyl was the lucky one to get totally unrestriucted access because it's the one that had the most evidence for beneficial therapeutic use.

" I have made this decision on the grounds there is some clinical experience and a more robust safety profile for this member of the alkyl nitrite family of substances given it has been used clinically to treat angina. "

so

Amyl for everyone

Isoamyl, and the Butyl's by prescription only, since their higher volatility presents a safety hazard for children and the elderly (and child safe lids)

Propyl is right out, since it's extreme volatility can pop the fuse in your eyes.

NONE of that says Amyl is the best or the safest, only that, as per judicial restraint, that Amyl was previously studied and authorized for treatment of angina and the Butyls weren't.

This panel was given a nightmare task; it sounds like the decision was well thought out,.

padre said on Sat, 25 Mar 2023 at 18:33...

https://www.tga.gov.au/sites/default/files/final-decisions-matters-referred-march-2019-joint-acms-accs-meeting.pdf

Nitritespecialist said on Wed, 29 Mar 2023 at 13:43...

FYI....isoamyl, isopentyl, n-amyl and n-pentyl are all considered "amyl nitrite". They are isomers. They have the exact same molecules, just arranged differently, which gives them somewhat different properties.

I called the manager of Locker Room and he would not confirm that his poppers contained primarily pentyl nitrite. He didn't deny it either. He acted like it was a "trade" secret, but then stated he could give me the MSDS forms, which I didn't follow up on. In 2004, Locker Room was fined over 100K for smuggling amyl nitrite into the USA. This can be found online. The bottles were apparently deliberately mislabeled.

I have tried around 10 bottles of JJ from Canada and I can't say for certain they are pentyl nitrite, because the odors were complex and somewhat unfamiliar. BUT they didn't smell like fruit or a Locker Room(butyl nitrite) and they didn't smell "funky" like isoamyl nitrite can. I did not get any UNWELL feelings from them, but I also didn't get a great sense of euphoria.

anon said on Wed, 12 Apr 2023 at 20:23...

I am convinced that side effects are generally the result of side reactions and decay. After dialing in my own process on making them at home, I have not had the problems I had when buying from stores or ordering. I strongly suspect the reason why amyl never gave a lot of people problems is that it is very stable in comparison to other alcohols. I know if I over do it on acid when I make them, I end up with more issues related to anemia and developing a cough. I suspect that manufacture punch the acid hard in the process to make sure the reaction is driven to completition and then neutralize it at the end.

The Professor said on Sun, 16 Apr 2023 at 00:30...

Excess acid by itself doesn't present a problem; it's the fact that many/most manufacturers don't want to neutralize because, if done right, it reduces yield.

e.g. Artisanal in the beginning was not washing their product properly, and customers were complaining of headache, hangover like effects, sore throat, congestion, etc.

Poppers of ANY parent alcohol (providing the alcohols are within the human body's range of tolerance (cyclohexyl, amyl, butyl, tert-butyl) SHOULDN'T be an issue at all; the inhalation should be a very pleasant experience, the effects should be desirable, and the whole thing should afford a recovery time of about 5-10 mins with no lethargy or hangover bs.

poppers that DO have the nasty after effects and/or ill feelings during use are usually not produced with human inhalation in mind. Those poppers are typically acidic and infested with nitRATes instead of nitRITes (nitrates are a much higher body load than nitrites).

Aldehydes of the parent alcohol are a degradation product, and anyone who remembers the smell of Formaldehyde (the aldehyde of formic acid) knows that it is a VERY noxious compound to inhale.

Most of the other degradation products amount to nasty smells

The Professor said on Sun, 16 Apr 2023 at 00:40...

Since you are a maker, I guess I should mention the proper way to neutralize?

Just adding baking soda to the yield, and then stirring or spinning for X seconds/minutes won't do very much neutralizing at all (most of the acid is dissolved in the yield, which is NOT water soluble).

More comprehensive neutralization occurs if you add distilled water AND baking soda, then stir at high speed; the water and nitrite will create a temporary emulsion, giving the baking soda more access to the dissolved acid.

you can spin way ALL of the yield if left unattended, since hydrolysis is a decomposition mechanism.

I tend to sprinkle in the same excess molarity of neutralizer into the spinning emulsion of water and nitrite, and I don't let the whole thing spin for very long

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